GOM and TLEM model

Dear all,

I have been trying to import some of my own data sets into the new
TLEM model, I have set the model up to run successfully but when I use
the GOM application it does not recognise the new talus segment (where
the ank markers are positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded to
incorperate the new segment or is it worth me using previously
calculated optimised marker positions in my models?

best wishes

Hey Peter,

The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports the old gait model as well as
the new TLEM model has already been developed but has just not been put out for
download yet.

I can upload it right away in its current state. Documentation for the input
langange for the new leg is still lacking though and will probably not come
before together with next repository update. However, if you want to try it out
straight away, I can upload it in its current form. Please let me know if you
would like that?

The new input language should be possible to deduct from the
DataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait application using the TLEM leg.

I hope this helps.

Best regards
Michael Skipper Andersen
The AnyBody Research Project

To: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom: peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Wed, 3 Sep
2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Dear all, I have been trying to import some of my own data sets into the newTLEM
model, I have set the model up to run successfully but when I usethe GOM
application it does not recognise the new talus segment (wherethe ank markers
are positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate the new segment or is it
worth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker positions in my models?best
wishes


Explore the seven wonders of the world
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hey Michael,

 There is no real rush for the GOM application for TLEM. I was just going to
run through some comparison data sets to see how the model changes with the new
anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the GaitApplication out on my models if
it would help you in any way.

best wishes

Peter

— On Thu, 4/9/08, Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com> wrote:
From: Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, 4 September, 2008, 6:38 PM

Hey Peter,

The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports the old gait model as well
as the new TLEM model has already been developed but has just not been put out
for download yet.

I can upload it right away in its current state. Documentation for the input
langange for the new leg is still lacking though and will probably not come
before together with next repository update. However, if you want to try it out
straight away, I can upload it in its current form. Please let me know if you
would like that?

The new input language should be possible to deduct from the
DataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait application using the TLEM leg.

I hope this helps.

Best regards
Michael Skipper Andersen
The AnyBody Research Project

To: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom: peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Wed, 3 Sep
2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Dear all, I have been trying to import some of my own data sets into the
newTLEM model, I have set the model up to run successfully but when I usethe GOM
application it does not recognise the new talus segment (wherethe ank markers
are positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate the new segment or is it
worth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker positions in my models?best
wishes


Explore the seven wonders of the world
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Users of the AnyBody Modeling System help each other create biomechanical
models in the AnyScript language.Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hey Peter,

It would of course be useful if you want to try it out on some of your data.
Just out of curiosity, did you apply the “old” GaitApplication2 and lower
extremety model to your data already?

I will wrap up a version of the new GaitApplication2 that supports the new TLEM
model and upload it to the filesection some time this week.

Best regards
Michael

To: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom: peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Mon, 8 Sep
2008 13:12:52 +0000Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Hey Michael, There is no real rush for the GOM application for TLEM. I was just
going to run through some comparison data sets to see how the model changes with
the new anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the GaitApplication out on my
models if it would help you in any way. best wishesPeter — On Thu, 4/9/08,
Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com> wrote:From: Michael Skipper
Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com>Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM
modelTo: anyscript@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, 4 September, 2008, 6:38 PMHey
Peter,The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports the old gait model as
wellas the new TLEM model has already been developed but has just not been put
outfor download yet. I can upload it right away in its current state.
Documentation for the inputlangange for the new leg is still lacking though and
will probably not comebefore together with next repository update. However, if
you want to try it outstraight away, I can upload it in its current form. Please
let me know if youwould like that?The new input language should be possible to
deduct from theDataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait application using the
TLEM leg.I hope this helps.Best regardsMichael Skipper AndersenThe AnyBody
Research ProjectTo: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom:
peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Wed, 3 Sep2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript]
GOM and TLEM modelDear all, I have been trying to import some of my own data
sets into thenewTLEM model, I have set the model up to run successfully but when
I usethe GOMapplication it does not recognise the new talus segment (wherethe
ank markersare positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate the new
segment or is itworth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker positions
in my models?bestwishes
__________________________________________________________Explore the seven
wonders of the
worldhttp://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE[No
n-text portions of this message have been
removed]------------------------------------Users of the AnyBody Modeling System
help each other create biomechanicalmodels in the AnyScript language.Yahoo!
Groups Links[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Discover the new Windows Vista
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Micheal,

thank you for putting up the new GaitApplication, I have now been able to run
GOM in my models. But there seems to be a script error resulting in high
MaxKinError despite getting the MarkerPlacemetStudy to a reasonable level of
accuracy. The opt model also is causing a problem with finding initial
positions, and I can’t seem to get it to follow alterations to the mannequin
file. I noticed a similar pattern in the GaitUniMiami model as well. I’ve put
the model up on the forum.
Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Peter

— On Tue, 9/9/08, Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com> wrote:
From: Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, 9 September, 2008, 1:41 AM

Hey Peter,

It would of course be useful if you want to try it out on some of your data.
Just out of curiosity, did you apply the “old” GaitApplication2 and
lower extremety model to your data already?

I will wrap up a version of the new GaitApplication2 that supports the new TLEM
model and upload it to the filesection some time this week.

Best regards
Michael

To: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom: peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Mon, 8 Sep
2008 13:12:52 +0000Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Hey Michael, There is no real rush for the GOM application for TLEM. I was just
going to run through some comparison data sets to see how the model changes with
the new anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the GaitApplication out on my
models if it would help you in any way. best wishesPeter — On Thu, 4/9/08,
Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com> wrote:From: Michael
Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@hotmail.com>Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM
and TLEM modelTo: anyscript@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, 4 September, 2008,
6:38 PMHey Peter,The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports the old gait
model as wellas the new TLEM model has already been developed but has just not
been put outfor download yet. I can upload it right away in its current state.
Documentation for the inputlangange for the new leg is still lacking though and
will probably not comebefore together with next repository update. However, if
you want to try it outstraight away, I can upload it in its current form. Please
let me know if youwould like that?The new input language should be possible to
deduct from theDataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait application using the
TLEM leg.I hope this helps.Best regardsMichael Skipper AndersenThe AnyBody
Research ProjectTo: anyscript@yahoogroups.comFrom:
peter.worsley@yahoo.co.ukDate: Wed, 3 Sep2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript]
GOM and TLEM modelDear all, I have been trying to import some of my own data
sets into thenewTLEM model, I have set the model up to run successfully but when
I usethe GOMapplication it does not recognise the new talus segment (wherethe
ank markersare positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate the new
segment or is itworth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker positions
in my models?bestwishes
__________________________________________________________Explore the seven
wonders of the
worldhttp://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE[No
n-text
portions of this message have been
removed]------------------------------------Users of the AnyBody Modeling System
help each other create biomechanicalmodels in the AnyScript language.Yahoo!
Groups Links[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Discover the new Windows Vista
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Users of the AnyBody Modeling System help each other create biomechanical
models in the AnyScript language.Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Peter

I have uploaded a new version of your gait TLEM model it is named
Trial_TLEM_st.zip

It is not perfect yet though…

First of all I did not yet manage to make it run through the “SCALE” option
set in the Study.txt file, but it runs the POSONLY. This means that it has
optimized the joint angles to make the best possible fit with the recorded
data, but it has not optimized the marker location and segment lengths.

Furthermore a small temporary fix was needed in the
JoitnAndDriversOptimized.any file, since it that the gaitaplication2 returns
a knee angle exactly 180 off, compared to the way the AnyBody model measures
the knee angle.

This has been fixed by these lines which are a neat way of adding a constant
to a measure.

AnyKinMeasureLinComb KneeFix =

 {

   AnyKinMeasureOrg RightKneeFlexion1 = {

   AnyKinRotational KneeRot={

     AnyRefNode &ThighNode =

…HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Thigh.KneeJoint;

     AnyRefNode &ShankNode =

…HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Shank.KneeJoint;

     Type=RotAxesAngles;

   };

   MeasureOrganizer={0};

 };

  Coef = {{1}};

  Const= {pi};

 };

Inside the GaitApplication everything is ok, it when it writes out the
angles that it goes wrong.

Right now I am not sure what exactly goes wrong with the SCALE analysis, it
seems that the input files etc are all ok, but after a number of iterations
it fails as you describe. Until this is resolved I hope you can use the
results from the POSONLY analysis.

I think the next things to try out are different starting guess on segments
lengths and locking of more of the free markers, by changing the
optimization settings.

Best regards

Søren, AnyBody Support


From: anyscript@yahoogroups.com [mailto:anyscript@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Peter Worsley
Sent: 11 September 2008 17:33
To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Hi Micheal,

thank you for putting up the new GaitApplication, I have now been able to
run GOM in my models. But there seems to be a script error resulting in high
MaxKinError despite getting the MarkerPlacemetStudy to a reasonable level of
accuracy. The opt model also is causing a problem with finding initial
positions, and I can’t seem to get it to follow alterations to the mannequin
file. I noticed a similar pattern in the GaitUniMiami model as well. I’ve
put the model up on the forum.
Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Peter

— On Tue, 9/9/08, Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
<mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com> wrote:
From: Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
<mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
Date: Tuesday, 9 September, 2008, 1:41 AM

Hey Peter,

It would of course be useful if you want to try it out on some of your data.
Just out of curiosity, did you apply the “old” GaitApplication2 and
lower extremety model to your data already?

I will wrap up a version of the new GaitApplication2 that supports the new
TLEM
model and upload it to the filesection some time this week.

Best regards
Michael

To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom> ps.comFrom:
peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate> yahoo.co.ukDate:
Mon, 8 Sep
2008 13:12:52 +0000Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model

Hey Michael, There is no real rush for the GOM application for TLEM. I was
just
going to run through some comparison data sets to see how the model changes
with
the new anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the GaitApplication out on
my
models if it would help you in any way. best wishesPeter — On Thu, 4/9/08,
Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@ <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com>
hotmail.com> wrote:From: Michael
Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@ <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com>
hotmail.com>Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM
and TLEM modelTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
<mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comDate> ps.comDate: Thursday, 4 September,
2008,
6:38 PMHey Peter,The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports the old
gait
model as wellas the new TLEM model has already been developed but has just
not
been put outfor download yet. I can upload it right away in its current
state.
Documentation for the inputlangange for the new leg is still lacking though
and
will probably not comebefore together with next repository update. However,
if
you want to try it outstraight away, I can upload it in its current form.
Please
let me know if youwould like that?The new input language should be possible
to
deduct from theDataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait application using
the
TLEM leg.I hope this helps.Best regardsMichael Skipper AndersenThe AnyBody
Research ProjectTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
<mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom> ps.comFrom:
peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate> yahoo.co.ukDate:
Wed, 3 Sep2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript]
GOM and TLEM modelDear all, I have been trying to import some of my own data
sets into thenewTLEM model, I have set the model up to run successfully but
when
I usethe GOMapplication it does not recognise the new talus segment
(wherethe
ank markersare positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate the new
segment or is itworth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker
positions
in my models?bestwishes
__________________________________________________________Explore the seven
wonders of the
worldhttp://
<worldhttp://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QB
RE>
search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE[Non-text
portions of this message have been
removed]------------------------------------Users of the AnyBody Modeling
System
help each other create biomechanicalmodels in the AnyScript language.Yahoo!
Groups Links[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Discover the new Windows Vista
http://search.
<http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE>
msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Users of the AnyBody Modeling System help each other create biomechanical
models in the AnyScript language.Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Peter and Søren,

I had a look at the model and found a number of issues.

  1. The model was not walking forward in the positive x-direction,
    which was part of the problem. I have now changed the
    Main.Orientation such that this is the case. Please also have a look
    at the change I made in the MarkerMover.any file as well.

  2. The fix that Søren made with the flipped right leg was both ugly
    and dirty. However, there was a reason why the leg was flipped:
    GaitApplication2 was specifically asked to pick that solution out of
    the two that do always exist for Euler angles. The problem was that a
    sign in the EULERANGLE specification was missing on the knee
    specifications in the DataForConfigFile.any. When this was fixed, the
    leg was as it should be again.

  3. The reason why the optimizer was unable to solve the scaling
    optimization problem was because it was in fact ill-posed. Since
    there are only two markers on the feet (heel and toe), it is
    impossible to determine the length of the shank purely based on the
    motion. To fix this, I locked the ankle markers. Also, I generally
    changed which markers are optimized and which are not to a set that I
    have been recently using for a number of subjects. After doing that,
    the solver manages to find the solution. Please have a look in the
    DataForConfigFile.any file to see which markers are now optimized and
    which are not.

However, there are still a few things that you will have to address.

  1. The placement of the ASIS markers do not seem completely correct
    which result in the PSI markers being fairly far away from the
    skeleton.

  2. Which segments were the knee markers actually placed on? From your
    guess on the knee markers, it looks more like they were put on shanks
    rather than the thighs.

  3. The placement of the toe markers do not seem completely correct
    either. I doubt that the markers were actually all the way out on the
    toes?

I have uploaded a new version to the filesection called Trail
TLEM_msa.zip.

I hope this helps you move on.

Best regards
Michael Skipper Andersen
The AnyBody Research Project

— In anyscript@yahoogroups.com, AnyScript Support
<anyscriptsup@…> wrote:
>
> Hi Peter
>
>
>
> I have uploaded a new version of your gait TLEM model it is named
> Trial_TLEM_st.zip
>
>
>
> It is not perfect yet though…
>
>
>
> First of all I did not yet manage to make it run through
the “SCALE” option
> set in the Study.txt file, but it runs the POSONLY. This means that
it has
> optimized the joint angles to make the best possible fit with the
recorded
> data, but it has not optimized the marker location and segment
lengths.
>
>
>
> Furthermore a small temporary fix was needed in the
> JoitnAndDriversOptimized.any file, since it that the
gaitaplication2 returns
> a knee angle exactly 180 off, compared to the way the AnyBody model
measures
> the knee angle.
>
>
>
> This has been fixed by these lines which are a neat way of adding a
constant
> to a measure.
>
>
>
> AnyKinMeasureLinComb KneeFix =
>
> {
>
> AnyKinMeasureOrg RightKneeFlexion1 = {
>
> AnyKinRotational KneeRot={
>
> AnyRefNode &ThighNode =
> …HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Thigh.KneeJoint;
>
> AnyRefNode &ShankNode =
> …HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Shank.KneeJoint;
>
>
>
> Type=RotAxesAngles;
>
> };
>
> MeasureOrganizer={0};
>
> };
>
> Coef = {{1}};
>
> Const= {pi};
>
> };
>
>
>
> Inside the GaitApplication everything is ok, it when it writes out
the
> angles that it goes wrong.
>
>
>
> Right now I am not sure what exactly goes wrong with the SCALE
analysis, it
> seems that the input files etc are all ok, but after a number of
iterations
> it fails as you describe. Until this is resolved I hope you can use
the
> results from the POSONLY analysis.
>
>
>
> I think the next things to try out are different starting guess on
segments
> lengths and locking of more of the free markers, by changing the
> optimization settings.
>
>
>
> Best regards
>
> Søren, AnyBody Support
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: anyscript@yahoogroups.com [mailto:anyscript@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf
> Of Peter Worsley
> Sent: 11 September 2008 17:33
> To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
>
>
>
> Hi Micheal,
>
> thank you for putting up the new GaitApplication, I have now been
able to
> run GOM in my models. But there seems to be a script error
resulting in high
> MaxKinError despite getting the MarkerPlacemetStudy to a reasonable
level of
> accuracy. The opt model also is causing a problem with finding
initial
> positions, and I can’t seem to get it to follow alterations to the
mannequin
> file. I noticed a similar pattern in the GaitUniMiami model as
well. I’ve
> put the model up on the forum.
> Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Peter
>
> — On Tue, 9/9/08, Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
> <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com> wrote:
> From: Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
> <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
> To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
> Date: Tuesday, 9 September, 2008, 1:41 AM
>
> Hey Peter,
>
> It would of course be useful if you want to try it out on some of
your data.
> Just out of curiosity, did you apply the “old” GaitApplication2 and
> lower extremety model to your data already?
>
> I will wrap up a version of the new GaitApplication2 that supports
the new
> TLEM
> model and upload it to the filesection some time this week.
>
> Best regards
> Michael
>
> To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom>
ps.comFrom:
> peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate>
yahoo.co.ukDate:
> Mon, 8 Sep
> 2008 13:12:52 +0000Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
>
> Hey Michael, There is no real rush for the GOM application for
TLEM. I was
> just
> going to run through some comparison data sets to see how the model
changes
> with
> the new anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the
GaitApplication out on
> my
> models if it would help you in any way. best wishesPeter — On
Thu, 4/9/08,
> Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@ <mailto:msandersen60%
40hotmail.com>
> hotmail.com> wrote:From: Michael
> Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@ <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com>
> hotmail.com>Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM
> and TLEM modelTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
> <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comDate> ps.comDate: Thursday, 4
September,
> 2008,
> 6:38 PMHey Peter,The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports
the old
> gait
> model as wellas the new TLEM model has already been developed but
has just
> not
> been put outfor download yet. I can upload it right away in its
current
> state.
> Documentation for the inputlangange for the new leg is still
lacking though
> and
> will probably not comebefore together with next repository update.
However,
> if
> you want to try it outstraight away, I can upload it in its current
form.
> Please
> let me know if youwould like that?The new input language should be
possible
> to
> deduct from theDataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait
application using
> the
> TLEM leg.I hope this helps.Best regardsMichael Skipper AndersenThe
AnyBody
> Research ProjectTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
> <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom> ps.comFrom:
> peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate>
yahoo.co.ukDate:
> Wed, 3 Sep2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript]
> GOM and TLEM modelDear all, I have been trying to import some of my
own data
> sets into thenewTLEM model, I have set the model up to run
successfully but
> when
> I usethe GOMapplication it does not recognise the new talus segment
> (wherethe
> ank markersare positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate
the new
> segment or is itworth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker
> positions
> in my models?bestwishes
> __________________________________________________________Explore
the seven
> wonders of the
> worldhttp://
> <worldhttp://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-
US&form=QB
> RE>
> search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=7+wonders+world&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE
[Non-text
> portions of this message have been
> removed]------------------------------------Users of the AnyBody
Modeling
> System
> help each other create biomechanicalmodels in the AnyScript
language.Yahoo!
> Groups Links[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> __________________________________________________________
> Discover the new Windows Vista
> http://search.
> <http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-
US&form=QBRE>
> msn.com/results.aspx?q=windows+vista&mkt=en-US&form=QBRE
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Users of the AnyBody Modeling System help each other create
biomechanical
> models in the AnyScript language.Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Hi Michael,

thank you for looking at the model and giving your recommendations. These data
sets are from an external source so unfortunately I didn’t have full control
over marker positions. I am getting many data sets like this, and your advice is
greatly appreciated.

 The reason for the poor orientation was the fact I couldn’t stop the
opt.mannequin from loading and this was impairing my sight for the initialpos.
I’ll take a look at the model and address the issues you have suggested.

many thanks

Peter

— On Mon, 15/9/08, msandersen60 <msandersen60@hotmail.com> wrote:
From: msandersen60 <msandersen60@hotmail.com>
Subject: [AnyScript] Re: GOM and TLEM model
To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, 15 September, 2008, 11:56 PM

Hi Peter and Søren,

I had a look at the model and found a number of issues.

  1. The model was not walking forward in the positive x-direction,
    which was part of the problem. I have now changed the
    Main.Orientation such that this is the case. Please also have a look
    at the change I made in the MarkerMover.any file as well.

  2. The fix that Søren made with the flipped right leg was both ugly
    and dirty. However, there was a reason why the leg was flipped:
    GaitApplication2 was specifically asked to pick that solution out of
    the two that do always exist for Euler angles. The problem was that a
    sign in the EULERANGLE specification was missing on the knee
    specifications in the DataForConfigFile.any. When this was fixed, the
    leg was as it should be again.

  3. The reason why the optimizer was unable to solve the scaling
    optimization problem was because it was in fact ill-posed. Since
    there are only two markers on the feet (heel and toe), it is
    impossible to determine the length of the shank purely based on the
    motion. To fix this, I locked the ankle markers. Also, I generally
    changed which markers are optimized and which are not to a set that I
    have been recently using for a number of subjects. After doing that,
    the solver manages to find the solution. Please have a look in the
    DataForConfigFile.any file to see which markers are now optimized and
    which are not.

However, there are still a few things that you will have to address.

  1. The placement of the ASIS markers do not seem completely correct
    which result in the PSI markers being fairly far away from the
    skeleton.

  2. Which segments were the knee markers actually placed on? From your
    guess on the knee markers, it looks more like they were put on shanks
    rather than the thighs.

  3. The placement of the toe markers do not seem completely correct
    either. I doubt that the markers were actually all the way out on the
    toes?

I have uploaded a new version to the filesection called Trail
TLEM_msa.zip.

I hope this helps you move on.

Best regards
Michael Skipper Andersen
The AnyBody Research Project

— In anyscript@yahoogroups.com, AnyScript Support
<anyscriptsup@…> wrote:
>
> Hi Peter
>
>
>
> I have uploaded a new version of your gait TLEM model it is named
> Trial_TLEM_st.zip
>
>
>
> It is not perfect yet though…
>
>
>
> First of all I did not yet manage to make it run through
the “SCALE” option
> set in the Study.txt file, but it runs the POSONLY. This means that
it has
> optimized the joint angles to make the best possible fit with the
recorded
> data, but it has not optimized the marker location and segment
lengths.
>
>
>
> Furthermore a small temporary fix was needed in the
> JoitnAndDriversOptimized.any file, since it that the
gaitaplication2 returns
> a knee angle exactly 180 off, compared to the way the AnyBody model
measures
> the knee angle.
>
>
>
> This has been fixed by these lines which are a neat way of adding a
constant
> to a measure.
>
>
>
> AnyKinMeasureLinComb KneeFix =
>
> {
>
> AnyKinMeasureOrg RightKneeFlexion1 = {
>
> AnyKinRotational KneeRot={
>
> AnyRefNode &ThighNode =
> …HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Thigh.KneeJoint;
>
> AnyRefNode &ShankNode =
> …HumanModel.Right.Leg.Seg.Shank.KneeJoint;
>
>
>
> Type=RotAxesAngles;
>
> };
>
> MeasureOrganizer={0};
>
> };
>
> Coef = {{1}};
>
> Const= {pi};
>
> };
>
>
>
> Inside the GaitApplication everything is ok, it when it writes out
the
> angles that it goes wrong.
>
>
>
> Right now I am not sure what exactly goes wrong with the SCALE
analysis, it
> seems that the input files etc are all ok, but after a number of
iterations
> it fails as you describe. Until this is resolved I hope you can use
the
> results from the POSONLY analysis.
>
>
>
> I think the next things to try out are different starting guess on
segments
> lengths and locking of more of the free markers, by changing the
> optimization settings.
>
>
>
> Best regards
>
> Søren, AnyBody Support
>
>
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: anyscript@yahoogroups.com [mailto:anyscript@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf
> Of Peter Worsley
> Sent: 11 September 2008 17:33
> To: anyscript@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
>
>
>
> Hi Micheal,
>
> thank you for putting up the new GaitApplication, I have now been
able to
> run GOM in my models. But there seems to be a script error
resulting in high
> MaxKinError despite getting the MarkerPlacemetStudy to a reasonable
level of
> accuracy. The opt model also is causing a problem with finding
initial
> positions, and I can’t seem to get it to follow alterations to the
mannequin
> file. I noticed a similar pattern in the GaitUniMiami model as
well. I’ve
> put the model up on the forum.
> Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Peter
>
> — On Tue, 9/9/08, Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
> <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com> wrote:
> From: Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
> <mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com> hotmail.com>
> Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
> To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
> Date: Tuesday, 9 September, 2008, 1:41 AM
>
> Hey Peter,
>
> It would of course be useful if you want to try it out on some of
your data.
> Just out of curiosity, did you apply the “old” GaitApplication2
and
> lower extremety model to your data already?
>
> I will wrap up a version of the new GaitApplication2 that supports
the new
> TLEM
> model and upload it to the filesection some time this week.
>
> Best regards
> Michael
>
> To: anyscript@yahoogrou <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom>
ps.comFrom:
> peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate>
yahoo.co.ukDate:
> Mon, 8 Sep
> 2008 13:12:52 +0000Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM and TLEM model
>
> Hey Michael, There is no real rush for the GOM application for
TLEM. I was
> just
> going to run through some comparison data sets to see how the model
changes
> with
> the new anthropometrics. I would be happy to try the
GaitApplication out on
> my
> models if it would help you in any way. best wishesPeter — On
Thu, 4/9/08,
> Michael Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@ <mailto:msandersen60%
40hotmail.com>
> hotmail.com> wrote:From: Michael
> Skipper Andersen <msandersen60@
<mailto:msandersen60%40hotmail.com>
> hotmail.com>Subject: RE: [AnyScript] GOM
> and TLEM modelTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
> <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comDate> ps.comDate: Thursday, 4
September,
> 2008,
> 6:38 PMHey Peter,The version of GaitApplication2 that both supports
the old
> gait
> model as wellas the new TLEM model has already been developed but
has just
> not
> been put outfor download yet. I can upload it right away in its
current
> state.
> Documentation for the inputlangange for the new leg is still
lacking though
> and
> will probably not comebefore together with next repository update.
However,
> if
> you want to try it outstraight away, I can upload it in its current
form.
> Please
> let me know if youwould like that?The new input language should be
possible
> to
> deduct from theDataForConfigFile.any file in the new gait
application using
> the
> TLEM leg.I hope this helps.Best regardsMichael Skipper AndersenThe
AnyBody
> Research ProjectTo: anyscript@yahoogrou
> <mailto:anyscript%40yahoogroups.comFrom> ps.comFrom:
> peter.worsley@ <mailto:peter.worsley%40yahoo.co.ukDate>
yahoo.co.ukDate:
> Wed, 3 Sep2008 14:18:37 +0000Subject: [AnyScript]
> GOM and TLEM modelDear all, I have been trying to import some of my
own data
> sets into thenewTLEM model, I have set the model up to run
successfully but
> when
> I usethe GOMapplication it does not recognise the new talus segment
> (wherethe
> ank markersare positioned). Will the GOM be upgraded toincorperate
the new
> segment or is itworth me using previouslycalculated optimised marker
> positions
> in my models?bestwishes
> __________________________________________________________Explore
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> Users of the AnyBody Modeling System help each other create
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